Lawn Mower Tires on Mini Trucks?

[Samurai9]

I got my Hijet yesterday. Right off the delivery truck it was clear something was wrong. I was hearing a very loud thumping noise. A quick look at the tires showed that the front ones were hitting the body and wheel well and were being sliced to bits, even though the well had been chopped to make room for the tires, and despite the 3 inch lift. I have now spent hours trying to find smaller tires that will fit on the nice custom wheels. The existing tires are 25x11-12, Goodyear Rawhide Grip. I am considering replacing the front tires with Carlisle Turf Chief, 23x10.50-12. These are not mud tires but still have a fairly aggressive tread. Their load capacity is more than enough for the truck. I am hoping that the two inches smaller diameter will solve my scraping problem. I realize that I might have a bit more difficulty getting up steep hills in the woods. I also have the original wheels, which are 12x4 or 5 and very plain.

Any comments or suggestions?

Thanks,

Samurai

[greg0187]

10-12" wide! :eek: Thats probably most of your problem. Try to stay with no greater than 8" wide on the front. Seems alot of people like the Carlisle All-Trails.

[dwink]

I have the same tires except I have 25-8/12 on front and 25-10/12 on rear on series seven ITP's. 11's don't work on front!!!!!

[Samurai9]

So I can solve my problem with narrower tires at the front? I don't have to go to 23" diameter?

Thanks,

Samurai

[greg0187]

More than likely. Check this chart from xRoads imports for your application.

http://www.xroadsimport.com/xri/uploads/File/FitChartPDF.pdf

-Greg

[Dan]

What ever you end up doing, make sure that you don't mix up the height of the tires. They have to match the same circumference all the way around for 4x4. the axles will try to turn at the same rate front and rear, and if the tires dont match, it will stress the drive train and wear out the tires prematurely

[draggbody]

what is the width of the front rims?? if they are wide like the rear you will need different wheels as well... the offset may be part of your problem as well... can you take a few pics like strait down the side so we can see how much they stick out...

[Samurai9]

Dan,

Thanks for the warning. I was considering the possiblity of putting 23 inch tires on the front and leaving the 25 inch tires on the rear. I prefer to retain the Motto wheels because they look so much better than the stock wheels. I still can't figure this thing out. The best thing for me would be to replace only the front tires and retain the custom wheels and the big back tires. Short of that, I would replace all four tires but keep the custom wheels, which I believe are 12x7. But it is essential that I eliminate the tire/body contact.

Thanks,

Samurai

[greg0187]

Link no workie. Try this.

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/1995%20Daihatsu%20Hijet/

[draggbody]

this one works...

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/1995%20Daihatsu%20Hijet/

i would go w/ the 25-8-12s and i think it will be good to go...

edit: you beat me to it...

[greg0187]

Those tires look huge. It needs 3 more inches of lift.:D

[greg0187]

this one works...

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/1995%20Daihatsu%20Hijet/

i would go w/ the 25-8-12s and i think it will be good to go...

edit: you beat me to it...

Hey draggbody! Even though I beat you too it. :D I'm impressed. Not too many people I know can fix a broken link.
-Greg

[Samurai9]

This is what I came up with:

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/1995%20Daihatsu%20Hijet/?action=view&current=IM001506.jpg

You guys are sharp!

Samurai

[Samurai9]

Thanks for the suggestions, but I don't see how putting on a tire which is three inches narrower would solve the interference problem. Please explain. I guess I could put 23x10.5-12 all around. Wouldn't reducing the diameter by two inches do the job? Wouldn't this mean an extra inch of clearance around the front tires?

Thanks,

Samurai

[greg0187]

The question is "does it rub with the wheel straight". If it does then a narrower tire probably won't fix the problem. If it rubs when you turn then you will probably be OK with a narrower tire. I'm not sure what the offset of your wheels are but it looks to me that the bulk of the tire is under the truck. Typically you want a 5" of backspacing on a 7" wide wheel. That is where 5" of the wheel is to the inside of the hub and 2" to the outside of the hub.

-Greg

[greg0187]

BTW. I saw your nice shiny new red Ford at camp copperhead. ;)

[dwink]

Check your rim offset. I run 25's with a 4 + 3 offset, 4 being the inside offset. The narrower tire will work in this setup. Did you buy this truck already set up like this or did you buy these wheels and put on there?

[Samurai9]

dwink,

I would not put on tires which are too big and run them for six months while they are being cut up by the truck body. That is what the prior owner did, and his father owns a tire store! No, the truck arrived on Wednesday and I haven't done a thing to it.

I will check on the wheel offset, about which I know nothing. I am not a car person, I am a gun nut, among other things.

I bought 38 acres in Cheatham County, TN, last summer. I have cleared a road up to some small waterfalls and then improved the old logging road on the other side. Now you can drive from one end of my property to the other, over one of the waterfalls. The truck photos (Samurai99 album on Photobucket) show my new 2003 F150 with four wheel drive and offroad package going over the waterfall. I am delighted that this truck can go right up the steep hill without a slip. The Hijet did the same thing on Wednesday. I bought it for going through the woods and brambles. The Ford is too big and nice to do that. I am very grateful for the suggestions and comments. I have relatives coming to town in a week and would like to have the Hijet squared away by then.

The front tires seem to be hitting only when the steering wheel is turned. I turned the steering wheel, got out of the truck, and could see where the tires were hitting the body--mainly to the back. The wheel wells have been cut to make more space and I don't think I want to cut any more.

Samurai

[draggbody]

your thinking is correct w/ the smaller tire, but the narrower tires work... if you want to keep that wide stance, you could try the shorter tire, but i dont know... i like the tall skinny look and it usually only requires minimal trimming... take it for what its worth....

[Samurai9]

Mr. Draggbody,

Based on what people are telling me, I should be able to replace the Goodyear Rawhide Grip tires at the front (now 25x11-12) with narrower tires (25x8-12) and eliminate the hitting. Do you agree? Can I put the narrower tires on the existing seven inch wide wheels?

Thanks,

Samurai

[Samurai9]

Greg,

The front tires do not hit when the truck is going straight, only when turning. But this is unloaded and without any bouncing.

If you are correct, I could switch the front tires to a narrower Rawhide Grip (25x8-12). Then I could keep the rear tires
(25x11-12), which are in very good condition and not hitting. I would then have the same look front and back and the same aggressive tread for going up hills.

How say you?

Samurai



The question is "does it rub with the wheel straight". If it does then a narrower tire probably won't fix the problem. If it rubs when you turn then you will probably be OK with a narrower tire. I'm not sure what the offset of your wheels are but it looks to me that the bulk of the tire is under the truck. Typically you want a 5" of backspacing on a 7" wide wheel. That is where 5" of the wheel is to the inside of the hub and 2" to the outside of the hub.

-Greg

[Samurai9]

I hope this link works:

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/Hijet%20at%20Apache%20Trail/?action=view&current=IM001531.jpg

[Samurai9]

http://s266.photobucket.com/albums/ii252/Samurai99/Hijet%20at%20Apache%20Trail/Front%20Tires%20Hitting%20Wheel%20Wells/?action=view&current=IM001519.jpg

[greg0187]

I can't tell you for sure that it will not rub if U use 25x8 but I can tell you that it will help tremedously. R U sure it is a 3" lift?

-Greg

[Samurai9]

Greg,

No I am not sure if there is a three inch lift. This is what the seller told me but the lift was already in place when he got the truck about six months ago. I asked him if the lift had caused any problems. He said that the left cv boot was hitting something and ripped but he tightened it down and that eliminated the problem. So I am sure the truck has been lifted, but I cannot be sure of the amount.

Samurai

[greg0187]

If U look at the top of the front strut you should see a spacer. That will tell you what the lift is. The main problem I think you will be facing is "Do you replace all 4 tires or just 2" That is the gamble you will have to take. There are not too many people on this board running anything greater than an 8" wide tire on the front, and its my understanding that a 25x8" tire w/3" lift w/ minimal trimming should work fine.
-Greg

[Samurai9]

Thanks, Greg. I will look for the spacer. The door and wheel wells have already been hacked to make room for the tires. I am going to look for a local (Nashville) source for these tires. They are Goodyears, after all. I can order them from Moto4less for a decent price and shipping cost.

Samurai

[Dan]

Looks to me to be a diameter problem. and theres no more room to cut anything. looks like you're cut out right up to the seams. I think you were on the right track in the beginning, when you mentioned a smaller tire diameter. narrowing may help solve the rub on the flat ground but you will still have only marginal clearance for the rough terrain.

[Samurai9]

Dan,

The truck was cut when I got it. I would not do that. I would have gotten tires that would have worked with the truck the way it was built. On the other hand, the truck must have tires that make it drive well off-road.

I can't afford to buy new tires that don't solve my problem completely. I think the safest action would be replacing the front tires with two which are both narrower in diameter and in width. This will necessitate replacing the perfectly good rear tires in order to have the same diameter front and back, as other have pointed out.

Samurai

[greg0187]

If you put smaller tires only on the front. Don't use the 4WD.

[Samurai9]

Greg, I understand that with four wheel drive, I will have to use the same diameter tires front and rear. I believe I am going to have to replace all four tires with 23 inchers to stop the interference at the front. I am looking for 23inch tires with an aggressive, knobby tread and adequate load capacity. There is the AMS Swamp Fox in 23x8-12 and others. I believe my rims are
12x7.

Thanks,

Samurai

[Ak thrower]

Did you ever measure the backspace on your wheels ? I curious to know what it is .

Thanks
Bret

[Samurai9]

Sorry, I don't know what backspace is. The wheels are supposed to be Motto (AMS Racing) but I have never been able to find anything on them online.

I have spent so many hours on this. I am tempted to try Rawhide Grip in
25x8-12 on the front and do a little filing on the wheel wells if necessary. These tires would fit on the 12x7 wheels? That way I could use my current wheels and rear tires. Going to 23 inch tires would be safer but would lower ground clearance, even if I could find some suitable ones. I will be using the truck on hilly ground.

Samurai

[Dan]

back spacing/offset is the measurement from the mounting plate of the rim to the lip where the bead is seated. I have 12x7 rims with no offset (the plate is centered in the wheel) and they measure 3 1/2 inches from either side when you measure them. a positive off set would measure something like 2" on the back side of the rim and 5" on the outer side. Too much offset will position the tires further out of the wheel wells and possibly cause the body interference that you are experiencing.

You have a good looking truck, too bad someone didn't think this through before they sold it to you like this. Is there an atv or tire shop that you could visit for a little hands on advice. its hard to really help through viewing 2 dimensional pictures. they may even let you try on some different sizes

[Samurai9]

Dan,

I have made many calls to local Nashville tire stores and ATV dealers. They do not seem to carry the tires I need. I will have to order over the Net. I am leaning towards getting two Rawhide Grip tires in 25x8-12. I believe that moving the outside of the tire inwards by three inches will give me the clearance I need. This option allows me to retain the current look of the truck and the current ground clearance. I will be using the truck for hauling on my land but nothing really heavy, I imagine.

I have taken this truck up and down my steep hill twice. The four wheel drive works very well. Coming down the steepest area, I almost hit the front of the truck on the rock creek bed. If I lowered the truck by two inches, I might have a problem.

Samurai

[Ak thrower]

You do have a great looking truck . I'm wanting to build a truck similar to what you have .
Measuring the backspace is easy ... just put a straight edge on the back side of the wheel and measure to the bolt flange .
Also make sure of how much lift you have ... I'm curious to know that too .

Thanks
Bret

[Samurai9]

Bret,

From the photos I saw on on eBay, I liked the brush guard, the trailer hitch, the wheels and tires. I was afraid that the camo was a vinyl stick on, but it is paint. The bed has a liner and the seat covers are very good. There is supposed to be a working CD player but I haven't had a chance to check it, nor the heater. I have noticed that the left headlight and the left rear brake light are out. I don't know if this is a fuse or bulb problem. I see no way to check oil level. There is a locking cover on the oil fill opening but no dipstick that I could see. Is it somewhere else? The windshield wipers work.

The plastic front bumper has a broken piece at the left bottom. The brush guard is hefty but heavily rusted in places. Both the guard and the trailer hitch are slightly off-kilter to the body.

In the glove compartment were a number of manuals in Japanese. I was disappointed to find that they are all driver safety books, not details on the truck specifically.

I really like the truck and am impatient to get the tire problem resolved.

Samurai

[Dan]

If its just the outer edges of the tire that are a problem, then i think you're right with narrowing. I hope it works for you.

[greg0187]

On my 99 the oil dipstick is under the drivers seat on the side of the oil pan. The oil fill is under the passenger seat.

-Greg

[xroadsimport]

Samurai9,

The front tires seem to be spaced a long way out from the truck. Is there a spacer on the wheel? What kind of wheels are those? I would check to see what kind of lift you have and if it is indeed 3". Whoever cut the fenders took out a lot of fender.

Assuming it is lifted 3" then the 8" wide tire in the front should work fine. However some brands of tires will run wider than others. We have put wider tires on the front here but it takes some care to do right.

Things you need to check:

1) Lift Hight
2) Wheel Spacing. You want to know the width of the wheel and the distance from the back of the wheel to where the wheel mounts.
3) Actual tire width

If I know those three things then I should be able to tell you what will work.

[Ak thrower]

Cory .. those are the same things I've been trying to ask ........... no answers yet !

Bret

[Samurai9]

I know that I have not answered everyone's questions but some of them I cannot understand, others seem to require taking the wheels off the truck, the tire off the wheel, etc. I am 12 miles away from the truck so I cannot just go out in the yard and look. I will try to get back to all of you on these questions.

I was told that the wheels were Motto and I believe they are 12x7. The truck has obviously been lifted and three inches is the standard amount, right? The seller told me that the CV boot was ripping because the lift caused interference with something under the truck. I have not been under the truck to look for spacers.

I am now doubtful that putting on a narrower tire of the same diameter (25 inches) will help. Rawhide Grip tires do not come in 23 inches diameter for 12 inch wheels. Although going to the narrower tire would pull in the tires three inches towards the truck at the hub, as the tire surface moves up to the top, the reduction in width becomes less and less. The tires are hitting the body between 1:00 and 2:00, as I see it. Not hitting on the side nor on the very top, but along the curve between the two.

I keep looking at Carlisle All Trail but am thrown off by the statement that the tire is for hard surfaces. Most of my surfaces are soft dirt. Many of the tires with aggressive mud tire tread do not have enough load capacity.

Thanks for the interest and suggestions.

Samurai

[Ak thrower]

Samurai ..

Rawhide do come in 8" wide thou ! I found some a site http://www.rockymountainatv.com

[Samurai9]

Ak,

I stated several times that I was considering getting Rawhide in 8 inches wide. What I said was that it wasn't available in 23 inches diameter, only in 25 inches.

Samurai

[Samurai9]

More thoughts on this continuing topic (which may be exasperating to some), the Rawhide Grip tires have huge rubber lugs on them. This may make them more likely to hit the wheel wells than other tires which are nominally the same size, yes? It is these lugs that are hitting.

Another thought: instead of replacing the front tires, why don't I trim the lugs that are hitting? What do I have to lose? The lugs are already cut and even crumbling. If I trim some of the lugs, I may be able to preserve the tires. What do you think?

Samurai

[Dan]

save them for spares for the rear. try the 8's on the front

[matt419]

Although going to the narrower tire would pull in the tires three inches towards the truck at the hub, Samurai

Hello Samurai, this will only pull your tires in 1 1\2 inch. You are working from center. I agree with those stating 25x8x12. Also read some about the 3" lifts wearing your drive train out. As if you need something else to worry about. But I would hate for you to tear something up.

[Samurai9]

Matt,

You agree that switching the front tires from 25x11 to 25x8 will solve the problem of tires hitting the wheel well? Some have expressed doubts about this and I am not sure. I prefer to go this route because I can retain the rear tires and the road clearance. There is no problem putting 25x8 tires on 12x7 wheels? I have no knowledge of these things.

I have read about the problems caused by the three inch lift. I asked the seller about this. He told me that the truck was lifted when he got it and that the left CV boot was ripping because it was hitting the strut. He "scrunched" the boot in and had no problems thereafter. He had the truck for only six months. I have no confidence in his statements, but this is all the information I have. I do not intend to remove the lift because it MIGHT cause problems in the future. I will see how the truck works out for me, especially after I get the tire problem solved. I am sure I am going to have to buy a 12x6 trailer and haul the truck to my mechanic one day. When this happens, I will have everything checked out. I just got the truck a few days ago. The Hijet came from southeast Georgia and was dropped off at my rural property 12 miles from my home.

I knew going in that buying this 13 year old truck was risky. All I know now is that the truck starts, runs, and can take me where I want to go on my property. I will be using this vehicle very sparingly, just to run around my land and perhaps to haul some gravel, rocks, or limbs. I have no ability to work on cars and no desire to learn, beyond basic maintenance. I am a handyman around the house but I do not work on cars.

Thanks,

Samurai

[Dan]

The 8's will comfortably fit on the 12x7 rims. Thats about as close to a perfect match as you can get.

[Samurai9]

Good to know, Dan.

Samurai

[matt419]

Samurai, search "another lift causing problems" and see if this will help you understand. The CV joints are your axles per say to your front wheels. They are at such a angle that they are working in a bind. As for trailering your truck to the shop, you can pull this with a tow bar if you put the transfer case in nuetral. Hope this helps. I hate to see someone tear up something that could have been prevented.