View Full Version : Attention Dealers
12-17-2007, 01:52 PM
DEALERS and persons who can read Japanese :
Refering mainly to the Suzuki mini trucks..... What is axle lock ? What does it do ?
Does anyone read Japanese? There is a section on the drivers side visor written in Japanese concerning the axle lock "feature".
There has been much discussion on "axle lock" yet not many responses from the dealers selling the trucks. Myself and others have found that our axle lock does not "lock" the front axle as advertised / promoted ......
Here is a link concerning this topic....
and also the thread titled "4x4 question..." under "General Truck Info" (this same catagory)......
...Does anyone have a Suzuki that will "lock" / "pull" both front tires ?????
12-17-2007, 02:28 PM
It is rare for any vehicle designed for use on paved surfaces to have a locker or even posi in the front. Locking the front can/will make a truck break loose on the road (even on dry flat roads). I doubt they have front lockers from the factory. If they do though, could someone please post what models were available with this option?
I am from Florida and we build mud trucks there. The first mod we do when a truck becomes a trailer queen is to weld the front gears. You can drive circles around the same type of truck with an open front diff. The back diff is a given. A related question: Are the mini trucks with open diffs eqipped with regular spider gears front and rear (that could be welded), or are they some kind of hybrid that is enclosed? (save for the Honda and Subaru of course)
12-18-2007, 03:33 PM
Well, thats what I'm thinking... the "axle lock" "feature" that these trucks are being sold with is nothing more than "auto-locking hubs" , not a "locker" like they are promoted / advertised as.... Instead of locking the hubs manually its done with the "axle lock"..... My truck and others that I have spoken with that own Suzuki's do NOT pull both front tires.
So are the dealers just misinformed and dont even know what they are selling or does it just sound better to advertise a truck with a feature that isnt really a feature ? Or is it both ?
Before I bought my truck, I researched as much as I could. So I would get the right truck for me, and to educate myself with hopes of becoming a dealer this coming spring. I hope to be educated on these trucks and what they really do and are equipped with. Not what someone told me. .....Called dealers, emailed dealers...and every one I talked to that had a Suzuki with "axle lock", informed me that it was a feature that "locked" the front axle so both tires would pull / turn / dig...whatever. Some of those dealers are members here, yet in 3 different threads concerning this topic in the last month, there hasnt been really any replys. Why is that I wonder ???
Again, anyone out there have a Suzuki that will "lock / pull / turn " both front tires ???
Anyone read Japanese ??
12-18-2007, 07:21 PM
I have had several suzuki's. The last one had both diff lock and axle lock. I got it stuck while showing it to a customer, and engaged both locks and all four wheels spun. Did not help me get out of the hole, cause I was buried to the diffs, but it did show that it was pulling with all four wheels.
12-19-2007, 02:47 PM
I have had a few instances where all four tires pulled... a few. One is in the snow where there was little restriction on the tires...another was in the mud when I was hung up...all four tires pulled. Possibly why the tires pulled when you were buried up to the differentials ? No restriction on the tires, the truck was basically "floating"..? However many times when on uneven ground, approaches to hills, I only have 2 tires that pull at any given time. when there is restriction to any of the tires, that tire will not turn. I have gathered this from others also.....
So..? Does that mean that our axle locks just dont work then ?
Thanks for the input and reply abc....
Steves supermini 4x4s
12-20-2007, 09:08 AM
Did you ever open a can of worms.I will start by saying there are alot of changes in the Suzuki 660 models, they vary from styling to the 4WD actuators.AXEL lock is the same as locking the front hubs manually, it is NOT posi.or limited slip for the front as MIGHTYHAMSTER correctly noted earlier in this thread but the way the front axel is engaged into 4WD.When you move the transfer case lever to LOW the front axel automatically is engaged an you are now in 4WD low.Keeping the trasfer case lever in HIGH and then push the AXEL lock button now you have HIGH 4WD mode.I have had a couple Suzuki's that the transfer case had HIGH-LOW and the lever had the acuator button on this T-handle the button was used only for 4WD HIGH.On this same truck when you moved the transfer case lever to the LOW position the acuator was turned on automatically without touching the acuator button on the lever.These were early DB51t's 1990 models, the DD51t's I have had[92-94] have had the Axel buttons on the dash and worked the same way as the other Suzuki's mentioned above.Diff.lock is limited slip rear.
12-20-2007, 10:22 AM
Thanks for your input Steve.
I opened a can of worms huh.....???....:o
Well, I'm getting educated anyway.....;)
Seems to me from much discussion, there is no reason for anyone to advertise a Suzuki with "axle lock" as some special feature, let alone that it will "lock" both front tires.........
Anyone interested in buying a Camo Suzuki Dump with axle lock ?
(note: axle lock doesnt make both tires spin, just locks the hubs for ya, nothing special really )
Wanted : 90's Suzuki Dump , hi/low range, Differential Lock ....
12-20-2007, 12:55 PM
I am still confused about why there is an axle lock switch. My Suzuki has H/L transfer case. When the 4x4 is engaged, H or L, the axle lock light comes on & I cannot shut it off. If the transfer case is in 2 x 4, I can turn the axle lock on or off. I hope that I am not sounding like an idiot but, again, what is the purpose of this switch?
12-20-2007, 04:47 PM
No, you dont sound like an idiot.....if so, then so do I....;)
I agree, why the switch then? Mine does the exact as yours Rancher..... seems pointless to have a switch when it automatically comes on anyway....I asked that same question many posts ago...doesnt make any sense to me??
Anyone enlighten us ...???
12-20-2007, 06:31 PM
Frankly, I think what we need is one of our friendly and helpful Japan-based members to march right into a Suzuki dealership and ask "what the heck!"...or however one would say that in Japanese. :)
12-20-2007, 11:59 PM
Contacted the Suzuki service centre over here today (Japan).
They say the Axel lock, locks the hubs (front wheels).
Hope this helps everyone and clears it up.;)
I know some of you have already stated that (Hats off to Steve), but thought I`d get the clarification from the horses mouth to set some of you at ease. Steve`s answer on pg 1 of this thread is a pretty accurate guide, in regards to how it works.
12-21-2007, 07:53 AM
Thank You YoungAuto...... very much.
Makes sense now.....axle lock is nothing more than an automatic way of locking the hubs, not making it posi track to where both tires will pull....
I was gonna say, man there are alot of faulty axle locks then.......
Live and learn........:cool:
12-21-2007, 01:53 PM
Thanks for the clarification! If the truck does not have "axle lock", does that mean that it would have manual hubs?
12-21-2007, 04:58 PM
I have a Suzuki that has lock-out hubs. I don't have to worry if the lght is working.
12-27-2007, 05:36 PM
I got the same results as everyone on the axle lock testing on my 93 Suzuki. It upsets me because I paid $200 more because this one had axle lock.
03-12-2008, 08:31 PM
Here is a 1993 Suzuki that does Not have axle lock.....
confirmed it with the owner..
(link to ebay auction listing)
The reason it does not have "axle lock" is because it has "manual lock(ing)" hubs, not automatic (i.e. "axle lock").
I have not yet completed compiling all of the imporatant "axle lock" information from posts and research to put in a "sticky thread" as recommended by one of the site Moderator's, to put on top in the "General Info" section so that everyone, including dealers, can access it . I will have that done soon.
I do however see that many dealers, some of which are participants on this forum, and who have read the information and factual field testing/research done by members here, continue to advertise the Suzuki's as having special features such as "Axle Lock". Is this done in an attempt to mislead the buyer? I'm not sure, but there isn't too many if any reasonable explanation to include something as a special feature when it is not. I would be hesitant to make such a comment if I had not contacted dealers and specifically asked what "axle lock" does.
I could understand, if the trucks were advertised as having "axle lock" versus having the manual locking hubs (rare) like in the truck above , but that is not the case for most dealers.
Anyways, compiled axle lock info coming soon to a sticky thread near you.......
03-12-2008, 10:28 PM
Axle lock IS an option and I would have to call it a pretty good one. With axle lock you do not have to climb out knee deep in to a mud hole to lock your hubs. You just press a button. I would have to say that is worth $200 for the person complaining they paid for it.
03-13-2008, 01:00 PM
I have a '91 Suzuki with manual locking hubs (and no axle lock button), and it looks pretty much just like the one in that Ebay listing, which is supposed to be a '93. I also have a '93, which looks a bit different (round headlights, different dash, different console and lever for engaging 4wd and low range...). Is that really a '93?
I don't really think having automatic locking hubs is worth anything more, as I would always have my manual hubs locked in anyway (and be in 4wd) when I'm driving through mud holes. My Mitsus don't have an axle lock button, the hubs just automatically engage with you switch to 4wd. I wonder why Suzuki didn't just eliminate that button, as my '93 has it, but I don't have to push it to lock the hubs in. That happens automatically when shifting the lever to 4wd.
03-13-2008, 01:03 PM
Yes Bearscratch that is correct, and I agree. Getting out to lock the hubs is less convenient than it being automatic or by the push of a button and very well may be worth $200 more. What is not correct though is that axle lock is not a "locker" ( making the front axle "posi-trak) which is what this discussion is concerning. Trucks are being advertised and sold with axle lock as being a locker when it is not. That is the "complaint" that many have.
Here goes another bombshell on this topic, the reason you can't "turn off the axle lock button" when in 4WD is because the axle lock function has been energized by a micro-switch under the console that is controlled by the transfer case lever. I have disconnected the micro-switch on my 91 Carry and can now have 2WD low range for creeping around,if I want 4WD I can stop and push the dash switch.In low range without the axle lock button lit the front driveline is still turning,but is not engaged to the pinion.
03-13-2008, 06:18 PM
Now that most agree that axle locks only feature allows you to stay inside the truck and engage it, Here is my question.
Can you replace the front hubs and add TRUE lockers?
I don't care if I have to get out of the truck to turn the lockers, can you buy locking hubs and put them on a Kei class truck of ant kind?
03-15-2008, 03:16 AM
Good idea DRW.... I know in my old chevy trucks I used low lock in 2wd alot moving around trailers and hauling wood when I didnt need 4wd but needed the lower range....
Oldplug, ...Not sure, not sure enough to say one way or the other, but from what I have heard and Not seen, I believe the answer is no.... Somewhere on this forum I recall an outfit working on a locker for the rear, similar to what you would buy aftermarket for a domestic truck, but dont recall it being finalized and dont think Ive ever heard of anything for the front. ....
We shall see what time brings...in 2 years who knows what will be available for these trucks... I'd like to see some aftermarket lockers, .....and other things like maybe machine gun mounts and rocket launchers even????...:D
03-17-2008, 10:45 AM
I think I was the one that wanted to know about the rear locker option. I was ready to weld my spider gears together because I would get hung up plowing snow. One front and one rear would spin and I would stuck. Not bad, just couldn't move. I added 6, 50 lbs bags of sand and had no problems after that. It was enough to push both rear wheels down to keep me moving. Accelerated slower, however.
Here is my question/point. Aren't there any hot rodders in Japan that use these trucks for anything other than driving around town? If so, wouldn't you think they would have come up with lockers, hi-flow exhaust, bigger carbs, etc. to make them better and faster? There has to be something out there that can be bolted on.
03-17-2008, 09:34 PM
As far as the rear end goes.... I would just weld my rear end....however today, and am waiting on confirmation, located an outfit down south that supposedly has any rear end part a guy would want from just the gears, hogs head, axles, whole rear end units complete, etc... So what I'm waiting to hear, is if the have "diff lock" units that can be added and/or just a diiff. lock equipped rear end that can be swapped and also if it will work how much and/or with non-diff. lock rear end traded in , etc...????? Will post here what I find out when I do...
TRAX and HORNS
03-19-2008, 01:18 PM
This is interesting. I pulled 7 trucks out of the container in December. The last truck I started cleaning and pulling service(couple of weeks ago) on was a 93 Hi-Jet. I fired it up befor doing anything to it and drove it around a little bit. Put it in 4x4(low or high) turn the wheel and the truck started jumping side ways, and skipping. Went back to 2x4 and everything was cool. put it back in 4x4(low or high) turn and jumping, skipping again. That tells me for some reason both front and rear are locked in true 4x4. This is the only truck out of about 21 trucks that this has happen. It does have push 4x4 botton on the dash. Go figure.
03-19-2008, 02:12 PM
Was it a Climber?
03-21-2008, 03:44 PM
I have a Climber on the water. Is it special? I havent seen one yet....
03-21-2008, 05:37 PM
Oh yes. For sure thats what it has to be!
The climber is locking front and rear! That will definately cause it to skidder arounds.
I cant wait to play with it.
07-11-2009, 08:46 PM
For all of you who are confused about axle lock, differential lock, manual locking hubs I have a suggestion!!
Go out and get your mini truck stuck in a mudhole, then pull whatever levers, and push whatever buttons you want and see what they do.
Works for me:):frustration:
07-11-2009, 09:00 PM
This is quite an old dead thread. (Last post March of 08)
I think most people & dealers now are confident in their operation and function of the trucks.
Might not get many responses here.
However, your suggestion is a good one.
07-15-2009, 04:09 PM
Ya know...the sad, yet funny thing is, TO THIS DAY, I still get calls from people that have been told by other supposed experienced "dealers" that Axle Lock something different than what it really is. :sly:
02-26-2010, 12:25 PM
i have a 97 suzuki carry and it has diff lock is that just lick the axle lock or is it acutally a diff locker right now its just pulling with one wheel on each axle pulling in forward or reverse
TRAX and HORNS
02-26-2010, 03:08 PM
to the right of steering wheel you will either have one are two indicators. they are axle lock and diff. lock. axle lock light is just indicating that front drive line is tied into front drive shaft.
if you have diff. lock that will be a switch, when activated it will pull a vacuum on the rear diff. and lock it into posi track(both rear tires pulling).
if you dont have diff. lock when in 4x4 high/low axle lock light on, yes, only one tire up front and one tire in rear will pull. although sometimes you will feel a sense of both tires pull in the rear if they both are sensing the same traction.
02-26-2010, 11:06 PM
I can't believe folks are still asking about the difference between axle and diff lock .... sigh ... it certainly aint rocket science... sorry quitting smokes right now... kinda edgy
TRAX and HORNS
02-27-2010, 05:50 AM
If you dont know, you dont know. I have retail customers that after a week cant find the dip stick. Or they ask me how come the blinker switch is on the wrong side. I say I wasnt the eng. on this truck, thats just the way they come. From the retail side of these trucks keep a happy face, answer questions as many times as ask and sell a good product.
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