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Poor running ACTY

Discussion in 'Honda Acty' started by Jakester, Jun 20, 2014.

  1. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    My 1995 with 72000 K starts fine when stone cold but runs poorly after warm-up. I assume these have electronic ignition. It acts like the points are bad if it had any. I can smell gas when its trying to start after warm-up. This problem happened a couple of years ago but not as severe and I changed the plugs and the problem went away. this time new plugs didn't help when I changed them last fall. The problem started last fall and I put it up for the winter. This spring it started and ran fine for awhile (1 month) but now its bad again. How often do you need to change the plug wires and could that be the problem?

    I have read all the threads about vacuum hoses but I haven't gone that route yet but I did put some sea-foam through it last fall. Any help would be appreciated!!:confused:
     
  2. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    no opinions????
     
  3. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    Choke not opening all the way and fouling plugs.
     
  4. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    Thanks Old Machinist, it idles back like it should after warm-up but responds poorly. Would a stuck choke do that?
     
  5. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    Yes, You'll need to take the plastic cover off the top of the carburetor to see if the choke is opening fully. To take the cover off you'll have to disconnect the fuel line and a couple of vacuum lines. Then after the cover is off reconnect the lines and run the engine until it's warmed up and check the choke position.
     
  6. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    Finally got a chance to look at the ACTY. The carb intake has a screen over it and is on its side, I couldn't see in there to check the choke. I did run a can of sea foam through it but it didn't seem to help. I'm still thinking it is more spark that fuel.
     
  7. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    The vacuum choke pull(red arrow) off likely isn't opening the choke fully. The diaphragm maybe bad or the vacuum line to it has a crack.

    VacuumPullOff.jpg

    The coolant lines(blue arrows) to the left of the pull off warm a wax unit to drop the idle speed as the engine warms up.
     
  8. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    Looked at the choke and diaphragm today and all looks fine. The diaphragm is not broken. Got the dist. cap off and found it full of rust and filings. the contact that the rotor button rides on was wore off smooth so it looks like it wasn't getting good contact. Maybe I have found the problem. Are these parts readily available? Thanks!
     
  9. Jakester

    Jakester Member

    Got the new cap on and truck runs like new. couldn't get the old rotor button off without breaking it, so I didn't get that changed. Is there a trick to removing it?
     
  10. My 1992 ACTY HA4 seems to be doing the same thing all of a sudden. When it's cold, it seems to run fine. It will 'idle up' for a while until it's warmed up as it always has. But, once it's warmed up, it will idle okay, but I can't rev up the engine very much. The more I give it the gas, the more it sputters and want's to die out.

    There was a wire that had broken off of a sensor under the engine, right next to the oil filter, but I fixed that and it didn't change anything. It still runs bad. I'm thinking it's a vacuum line, or the choke.

    Here is a short video of how it's running. Not a good video, but it's the best I could do by myself

    [video=youtube_share;uvEwttX5NIY]http://youtu.be/uvEwttX5NIY?list=UUGyPynS2QJCrc8Cg1UlwKxg[/video]
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2014
  11. shogun

    shogun Active Member

  12. Here is a short video I took today. In the first part of the video, it starts sputtering at lower RPM's and then I remove one vacuum line, and it will sputter, but at almost full throttle.

    You may also notice some smoke. It seems to be smoking a lot more than it did recently and it smokes more when it sputters. (blue smoke)

    I'm going to go back and see if I can test that solenoid you referred to in that video link. Thanks shogun.

    [video=youtube_share;1BqnHLXwxys]http://youtu.be/1BqnHLXwxys?list=UUGyPynS2QJCrc8Cg1UlwKxg[/video]
     
    Td90 likes this.
  13. shogun

    shogun Active Member

    Easy to remove the 2 solenoids and easy to test. Was same on my car with the smoking when I hit the accell, that was unburnt fuel, the smoke was black. The air valve/solenoid is not working, so when you push the throttle the additional air required to have the correct fuel/air mixture is not given.
    Black Exhaust Smoke Black exhaust smoke usually indicates there is not enough oxygen for proper combustion.
    An excess amount of fuel (overfuelling) for the amount of air an engine can supply. If the maximum fuel setting is greater than the manufacturers specs or if pollution controls have been improperly adjusted, there may not be sufficient air to burn all of the fuel.

    Blue Exhaust Smoke Blue exhaust smoke is the result of an engine burning oil. Common causes include worn piston rings, excessive crankcase pressure.
     
  14. How do I remove them? Pictures would help a lot because I'm not good at this sort of thing.
     
  15. shogun

    shogun Active Member

    In this repair DIY of the carb you can see that the solenoid is held by 2 screws, needs a plus driver
    http://blogs.yahoo.co.jp/kurumanosentakuya/archive/2012/3/25
    here you see the solenoids and the part numbers http://minkara.carview.co.jp/en/ima...00/001/808/517/1808517/p7.jpg?ct=e67d9860e4e9
    I found that on the japanese site for repairs / maintenance Honda Acty http://minkara.carview.co.jp/en/userid/1107954/car/1018655/1808517/note.aspx
    A bit difficult as we do not understand the language, I just clicked thru all the repairs for engine etc and found it.
     
  16. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member



    Try this, remove the air filter cover and filter to see if the problem goes away. If it does then most likely the air cut-off solenoid either isn't getting power or has gone bad. here are a couple of other ACTY threads with the same problem and the solutions.

    http://www.minitrucktalk.com/showthread.php?2274-Totally-Bizzare-Problem-in-Acty&highlight=solenoid

    http://www.minitrucktalk.com/showthread.php?6493-Carburetor-Air-Cut-Off-Solenoid-Revisited&highlight=solenoid
     
  17. Thanks guys. I'll work on it some more and post my results.
     
  18. I took the air filter off and tried it again. The problem seems to be worse without the air filter. It still runs fine and idles up to run fast when cold, but without the air filter in place, if I give it any gas at all, it will die out completely as opposed to sputtering as it did with the filter in place.
     
  19. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    Well that pretty much eliminates the solenoid.
    The next thing would be to make sure the choke is opening fully. You can't see the choke butterfly because of a screen over the mouth of the carb so you'll need to check it at the linkage.
    Two things control the choke, first there's a wax filled device that is heated by coolant that slowly opens the choke, second is a vacuum choke pull off that's supposed to pull the choke open if you open the throttle before the other thing has a chance to do its job.

    Back when most cars had carburetors the vacuum choke pull off was a major source of carb problems. Either the vacuum hose would get a leak or the diaphragm would go bad.
     
  20. Thanks Old Machinist. I'll check the choke pull off next.
     
  21. Well, I don't know what I did, but it is running better. I put the air filter back on and I manually operated the choke a few times with the engine running, and now it seems to be working a lot better. I sprayed all the linkage with a good dose of Fluid Film and put the cover back on.

    I was able to drive it up and down the field roads behind my house and it ran pretty good.

    I plan to change the plugs as soon as possible, because it still has a miss. I'm thinking the plugs fouled with all the bad running.
     
  22. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    I do hate it when the magic touch fixes something. You never know for sure what the problem was but yours sounds like the choke linkage was gummed up.
    Good Luck
     
  23. I went to my local mini truck dealer today and picked up a new air filter and a set of plugs. The old plugs were very wet. I had changed the plugs, filters, distributor cap, etc., when I bought the truck in July 2011. I've put about 1600 km on it since then.

    After changing the plugs, it ran a lot better, but still has some hesitation when first accelerating.

    It was fairly warm here today (about 70*) so that may have something to do with it running better. I'll keep y'all posted, and thanks for the help.
     
  24. Bad news. It's doing the same thing again. Just not as bad as before.

    If you notice in the video, it runs fine at idle and with a little bit of acceleration. But with a little more gas, it stalls, then i give it a lot of gas and it runs fine again. And, if I give it a lot of gas quickly, it seems to skip over the bad part and does fine.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that it runs bad at a mid range of gas pedal. I sprayed all the linkage again with WD 40 this time and worked it back and forth many times, but that didn't seem to help.

    [video=youtube_share;iHTqgUC6wdc]http://youtu.be/iHTqgUC6wdc?list=UUGyPynS2QJCrc8Cg1UlwKxg[/video]
     
  25. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    Under the cap with 3 screws and a vacuum hose that's right on top the carb there's diaphragm that operates a piston. I wonder if that piston is sticking or you have a vacuum leak.
     
  26. I did try removing that cap, but the screws have locktite on them and I could not get one of them out. I also tried removing the vacuum hose from the cap, but didn't notice any difference. I also tried to see if there was any leak on that hose, but couldn't find anything.

    I'll probably try to remove that cap again to see if I can inspect that diaphragm.
     
  27. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    I remember have to use a hand held impact screwdriver to get some of the screws out of my carb when I cleaned it.

    impactscrewdriver.jpg
     
  28. I got the cap off and operated the piston manually, and there was no difference. And when I put my thumb on the vacuum hose, I can feel the suction.

    I'm wondering if I should maybe go back to the cut off solenoid?

    [video=youtube_share;nc3wXoXYdVE]http://youtu.be/nc3wXoXYdVE?list=UUGyPynS2QJCrc8Cg1UlwKxg[/video]
     
  29. SUCCESS!!!;) I decided to go after the air cut off solenoid. I was able to remove it without taking the carb off. I had to use a 90* screwdriver and a 8mm wrench, but it came out.

    I tested it on a battery and the plunger would not move. It was stuck in there pretty good. I took it out and cleaned it up a little, and re-tested it, but it still would not move. So, I took the plunger out and replaced the solenoid. I was able to thread a bolt into the end of the tube to block it, and I stuck another larger bolt into the rubber tube that goes onto the brass tube, and secured it with the clamp.

    I did not remove any of the linkage to get it out, but I did have to bend a piece that sits over the solenoid to get it back into place. The part I bent doesn't seem to serve any purpose, but I put it back like it was anyway.

    I took it for a short test drive and it ran just fine. I'm not sure what the cut off solenoid is supposed to do. Can I just leave the plunger out? Or should I replace it? How will this effect the way my truck runs?

    Thanks for all the help. This interweb thingy is amazing!

    90* Screwdriver View attachment 14056

    Plunger removed and blocking bolt inserted
    View attachment 14057

    Loose, but not out yet
    IMG_0474 (1024x768).jpg

    Bending the linkage to get it back in.
    IMG_0476 (1024x768).jpg

    Re-installed. You can see the bolt in the end of the brass tube.
    IMG_0478 (1024x768).jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2014
  30. OldMachinist

    OldMachinist Moderator Staff Member

    The solenoid is a emissions thing. If I remember correctly it shuts off the bowl vent and pilot air port after the key is turned off to prevent fuel vapors from going to the environment. The only problem I've experienced since I blocked mine is if you try to restart the engine hot you may have to hold the gas pedal down briefly because it seems to flood. The vapors now go thru the pilot air port and into the engine.
     
    Td90 likes this.

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